Ajacieden in Oranje

jakobg · Bericht door **jakobg** » ma sep 05, 2005 8:32 pm

Carcajou schreef: I just LOVE Christiano Ronaldo. He's got skills, pace, vision. Of course he's a show pony, but who cares. He's a treat for the eye on a football field.

I'm a fan as well. His skill and flair is a joy for the eye. With those moves I don't care at all if he's a whiner or not.

Bericht door **Kowalczyk** » vr sep 30, 2005 2:19 pm

Five Ajacieden made it to Marco van Basten definitive squad for Holland's WC qualfifiers against the Czech Republic (away, 08 Oct) and Macedonia (at home, 12 Oct). These five are Wesley Sneijder, Hedwiges Maduro, Nigel de Jong, Olaf Lindenbergh and Ryan Babel. Urby Emanuelson was in the 'pre-selection' but dropped out.

K.

ZoefdeHaas · Bericht door **ZoefdeHaas** » vr sep 30, 2005 2:44 pm

I dont see how Olaf fits in the Oranje, but o well[/list]

aveslacker · Bericht door **aveslacker** » vr sep 30, 2005 3:22 pm

I'll admit I don't see that much of Ajax these days, but my impression is that de Jong hasn't been playing all that well these days. Why is he being selected? It just gives him a big head. Or am I wrong about his recent form?

Venezuelan Ajacied · Bericht door **Venezuelan Ajacied** » vr sep 30, 2005 8:43 pm

Van Basten has great faith in youth, i really like his coaching style, he´s got guts too :headbang: .

Ayman · Bericht door **Ayman** » vr sep 30, 2005 9:40 pm

Van Basten has great faith in youth, i really like his coaching style, he´s got guts too

Its true plus his Ajax connection really does help. I am just waiting for Johnny Heitinga to reach prime form and hit back at his critics

SE6Ajacied · Bericht door **SE6Ajacied** » vr sep 30, 2005 11:06 pm

Ayman schreef:
Van Basten has great faith in youth, i really like his coaching style, he´s got guts too
Its true plus his Ajax connection really does help. I am just waiting for Johnny Heitinga to reach prime form and hit back at his critics

Sorry Ayman but I've got a feeling that'll be a very long wait! :X

jakobg · Bericht door **jakobg** » za okt 01, 2005 8:59 am

What really happened to Heitinga? How come he want from that very promising youngster to the defender everyone seems to agree won't be good enough? (is there a thread for this guy btw? Didn't find any...)

ZoefdeHaas · Bericht door **ZoefdeHaas** » za okt 01, 2005 1:27 pm

I still think hes a first team defender thats really good, after one crappy game people say he sucks. Sure some places oveerate him, but that doesnt mean we should underrate him

dws · Bericht door **dws** » za okt 01, 2005 3:15 pm

I still think hes a first team defender thats really good, after one crappy game people say he sucks. Sure some places oveerate him, but that doesnt mean we should underrate him

I think we can compare Heitinga ,post injury , with Overmars. Overmars had a shitty last season at Ajax after recovering from a knee injury. It took Overmars that final season at Ajax plus the first half of a debut season at Arsenal to recover his form. Heitinga showed good form as soon as he was reintroduced to first team action at Ajax. Remember he played a full domestic season , Champions league and the Euro in Portugal.Also note that Heitinga was out for a lot longer than Overmars and had to undergo two operations. Maybe he has just suffered a reaction to all the playing time he had on his reintroduction.Only time will tell , but I hope Johnny can recover his form of season 03/04.

Bericht door **Kowalczyk** » za okt 01, 2005 3:31 pm

ZoefdeHaas schreef:I still think hes a first team defender thats really good, after one crappy game people say he sucks. Sure some places oveerate him, but that doesnt mean we should underrate him

I wish to add that I was never a fan. Not even in his best period. Just not the type of defender I believe in and to be honest I think his fantastic long pass is a myth... I don't remember too many, to be honest (I remember dozens by Frank de Boer and Ronald Koeman, for example; Heitinga's pass comes nowhere near).

I'm just not a fan and I seriously, genuinely believe that both Escudé and Grygera are better football players than Johnny Heitinga in almost every respect.

K.

Venezuelan Ajacied · Bericht door **Venezuelan Ajacied** » za okt 01, 2005 10:06 pm

If he has a future at Ajax, it will be as a right back, he is way to sloppy at times as center back.

dws · Bericht door **dws** » za okt 01, 2005 11:01 pm

I'm just not a fan and I seriously, genuinely believe that both Escudé and Grygera are better football players than Johnny Heitinga in almost every respect.

I can honestly say i was delighted when i heard Ajax were to sign Grygera. I believed he would prove to be a great addition to the squad. However , i think that Grygera has been culpable of poor defending in games, just as have all Ajax defenders this season (and last). We seem to have had a particular problem in central defence . Ajax in recent seasons have tried the likes of de Jong , Chivu ,Pasanen, Heitinga, Escude and Grygera in that area of defence . With the exception of Chivu, none of the above have been particularly convincing. Since losing Chivu Ajax have conceded too many goals for any other conclusion to be drawn. In the case of de Jong i trust him as a right or leftback and as a midfielder, but not as a central defender. As for Grygera , yes he is a good footballer , but as a defender he has yet to convince me that he can stay focused for the whole game.
It is this lack of focus that leaves Ajax vulnerable , particularly in defending at corner kicks and free kicks. Even though i am somewhat critical of Grygera i believe he is, along with Trabelsi, the best defender at Ajax.

SPL · Bericht door **SPL** » di okt 04, 2005 5:27 pm

I thought I would mention that I watched a bit of Holland u17's who finished 3rd in the U17's World Cup.

3 Ajax boys played and all looked good Jeffrey Sarpong in mid field scored 2 goals v USA , in the 3rd place game John Goossens scored both goals (Holland beat Turkey 2-1) and Vurnon Anita also looked good. ( he is a 16 year old midfielder and Ajax have given him a 3year contract) The other 2 are both 17 and I will be surprised if they are not given contracts soon.

It was pleasing that the 2 games I watched USA and Turkey all the goals were set up by and scored by the above 3 youngsters.

More young talent from this amazing club.

Van der Vaart · Bericht door **Van der Vaart** » do okt 06, 2005 1:53 am

Goossens and Anita are really good...Just could be form AJAX AMSTERDAM

About heitinga...

He is very good...he is not like the old times...

very good maker ,no fouls with him

he got the ball ,he is going ,going ,going ,he is in front of the keeper ,and GOAL ,WONDERFUL GOAL OF HEITINGA....

but now : on the bench ...... ......, ........,....... ,....... and Heitinga

I hope see him in World Cup

jakobg · Bericht door **jakobg** » do okt 06, 2005 8:04 am

Ehm, am I the only one not to understand shit of the post above?

Per · Bericht door **Per** » do okt 06, 2005 9:39 am

jakobg schreef:Ehm, am I the only one not to understand shit of the post above?

I thought it was a very poetic one. What is it that you don't understand?

Good players in Oranje - can only be from Ajax.

Heitinga is good, followed by a scenario described with much passion.

There you have it.

And oh, he wants Heitinga in the WC-team.

ZoefdeHaas · Bericht door **ZoefdeHaas** » do okt 06, 2005 10:36 am

Better than Bouma for sure

Bericht door **Kowalczyk** » do okt 06, 2005 11:01 am

ZoefdeHaas schreef:Better than Bouma for sure

I'm afraid I am not too sure of that.

Heitinga is more stylish and essentially a better football player. But he's just not hard enough. A defender needs to be cold, flawless and hard. Heitinga makes too many mistakes, which - in my eyes - makes all his qualities useless.

K.

343 · Bericht door **343** » do okt 06, 2005 11:41 am

Kowalczyk schreef:A defender needs to be cold, flawless and hard.

Just like Escudé? :nooo:
I like heitinga better. :yes:

jakobg · Bericht door **jakobg** » do okt 06, 2005 12:38 pm

Per schreef: I thought it was a very poetic one. What is it that you don't understand?

Good players in Oranje - can only be from Ajax.

Heitinga is good, followed by a scenario described with much passion.

There you have it.

And oh, he wants Heitinga in the WC-team.

Thanks for the translation. I guess all the dots and shit confused me. :)

AsgAarD_xxx · Bericht door **AsgAarD_xxx** » do okt 06, 2005 12:59 pm

jakobg schreef:
Per schreef: I thought it was a very poetic one. What is it that you don't understand?

Good players in Oranje - can only be from Ajax.

Heitinga is good, followed by a scenario described with much passion.

There you have it.

And oh, he wants Heitinga in the WC-team.
Thanks for the translation. I guess all the dots and shit confused me. :)

It's called litentia poetica ;) . Author might write wrong things if it will be any poetic effect ;) .

Anyway, I also believe that Heitinga will be good (or even very good) defender. In my opinion he must not be very strong and cold. His style, as Kowalczyk wrote, is different (and it doesn't mean: worse!!) and we shouldn't change him. He needs a little bit different training than, for example, Escude.

aveslacker · Bericht door **aveslacker** » do okt 06, 2005 2:38 pm

Can someone convince Stam to come out of retirement?

Bericht door **Kowalczyk** » do okt 06, 2005 3:13 pm

Just confirmed in the Dutch press: Oranje will travel to Prague with 20 players and Lindenbergh, Babel and Bouma are the one that have dropped out.

Two Ajax boys out; three to make the trip (De Jong, Sneijder, Maduro).

K.

Bericht door **Kowalczyk** » do okt 06, 2005 3:18 pm

dws schreef:I can honestly say i was delighted when i heard Ajax were to sign Grygera. I believed he would prove to be a great addition to the squad. However , i think that Grygera has been culpable of poor defending in games, just as have all Ajax defenders this season (and last). (...) Ajax in recent seasons have tried the likes of de Jong , Chivu ,Pasanen, Heitinga, Escude and Grygera in that area of defence . With the exception of Chivu, none of the above have been particularly convincing.

I just disagree completely with this one. Julien Escudé had a terrible game against Feyenoord recently, but if you ask me he's been great last season: almost 100% flawless, hardly any mistakes (he definitely made those in 2003-2004!) and increasing boldness in moving forward. That's why he scored 5 goals or something.

Same goes for Grygera: if you ask me he's one of the very few Ajax players at the moment who are absolutely and 100% beyond dispute.

K.