24 Aug 2005: Ajax - Brøndby IF

[Kowalczyk]

The THRILLER!! Wednesday August 24th is D-Day.

Brøndby lost their first two points in the Danish league today. They settled for a 0-0 draw at AC Horsens.

K.

[petelars]

Yeah, the boys were physcially and mentally drained for yesterday's game. Add that the opposition was very, very motivated... Well, BIF had the biggest chance in the game, but a tie was a fair shake.

[ZoefdeHaas]

Ajax 1-0 Brnby

De Jong goal :eusa_pray:

[bluedaddy19]

got my tickets today :headbang:

[Vendelbo]

Hey!

How do the majority of Ajax fans look upon this game? Is it seen as a walkover for Ajax or what? As you already know this game is f**** huge here in Denmark.

Kind regards

Vendelbo ;-)

[Kowalczyk]

How do the majority of Ajax fans look upon this game? Is it seen as a walkover for Ajax or what? As you already know this game is f**** huge here in Denmark.

It is definitely not seen as a walkover. We don't walk over anyone these days, and definitely not over Brøndby.

It is seen as a game that Ajax must win under normal circumstances, though. The danger lies in the fact that Brøndby have nothing to lose, whereas we've got everything to lose. Not qualifying for the Champions League would be generally seen as a major disaster and a tremendous moral setback before the season has even started. The pressure will most definitely be on Ajax - and that may be Brøndby's advantage.

My personal feeling is that Ajax have a higher quality team, and that we'll win if we play well. That is: if we can force Brøndby to adjust to our play and not allow Brøndby to make it a physical game. However, if we make mistakes Brøndby will definitely be good enough to take full advantage of it. So we'll have to be good - and that's not guaranteed these days.

What is the general expectation over there?

K.

[Vendelbo]

Hey!

What is the general expectation over there?

K.

Before the first game our national coach, Morten Olsen (remember him? ;) ), spoke that he thought Brøndby's chances of qualifying were 50/50. And parts of the press agreed with him. And it is as if the fans have jumped on the bandwagon and think that the chances are better than they are in reality. The press set the chances at 40/60 in favour of Ajax now - I agree with that accessment, I think.

Unfortunately I myself am not going to Amsterdam due to too much work, but still - I'm looking forward to seing some nice football on wednesday. That's one guarantee we have. Good football from both teams, no matter the result.

Kind regards

Vendelbo ;-)

[Philippe]

What is the general expectation over there?

Ajax wins thanks to a late minutes goal from Anastasiou, and I am not biased. :hypocrite:

[Brøndby Thomas]

What is the general expectation over there?

I disagree with Vendelboe. The generel expectation in Denmark are, that our chances are fairly small. AFCA is the better team and the club as a hole is more proffesional. The danish sites has perfomed very pourly the previuous years - and the lack for experience will be decicive. As seen in the first leg the Brøndby strikers lack the final sharpness to score the important awaygoals on one of the rather few chances we can count on to get in the ArenA.

Of course Brøndys chance are, at that the "young-and-promising-but-not-too-experianced-AJAX-site" will be under a lot of presure. If we get an early lead or keep 0-0 for a long time, maybe the ajax players will start to think about the consequenes of not qualifiing (and maybe of certain game against FC Copenghagen).

So you are definaly the favorites, but the favorites doesn't always win, as both Ajax and Brøndby have experienced many times in the past. So we hope for best, but exept the worst.

I would estimate 85-15 in Ajax' favour.

See you all on wednesday....

brdsgs
Thomas

[LouisXIV & co]

The 'general' expectation in my head is that Brondby will score the decisive 1-2 in the last 5 minutes of the game. And sorry to disappoint all Ajax fans, I'm almost always right with my predictions... :sad:

[edit] But.... Ajax will win the league!

[ZoefdeHaas]

Then predict something in our favour! X'C

This is definatley no match we should take for granted like Maccabi and Club Brugge etc. The pressure is on Ajax, and hopefully they will go through. Shame for Bronby, wouldve like them inCL as well

[Kowalczyk]

I agree with Zoef... I feel sympathy for this opponent. It's a shame we have to strangle them in order to qualify...

K.

[GangstaRiB]

I agree with Zoef... I feel sympathy for this opponent. It's a shame we have to strangle them in order to qualify...

K.

Maybe they strangle us. Ajax can lose to everybody at this moment. Only one decent game against psv, but at the Amsterdam Tournament it was crap. Add up to that we haven't played a single competition game yet and I think that Ajax has not yet reached a level where they can rely on each other. If Brondby plays with a lot of physical strenght and much passion they will have a good chance. Ajax always has difficulties against such teams, remember Brugge.

I just remember to well the games against: Lausanne Sports, FC Kopenhagen, Club Brugge and a while ago Celtic.

[aveslacker]

I have to say, based on the Brondby fans on these boards, and the photos I've seen on the 410 and F-side websites, the Brondby fans seem like stand-up guys (and gals). And fantasitc sfeeractie organizers, of course. Best of luck to Brondby! (But may Ajax make it through. :eusa_dance: )

[Kowalczyk]

Just checked the official Brøndby website: seems like they'll bring 2,100 fans. That's great. It will make for one hell of an atmosphere, I'm sure.

K.

[jakobg]

I woke up this morning dreaming that I read the teletext and saw a headline that said something like "Brondby shocked Ajax". The result: 1-2 in Amsterdam.

Don't know if my dreams mean anything; a couple of days I dreamt that I eat raw bacon sitting in a sailing boat, but still, no good sing.

[Kowalczyk]

Just posted this in the thread about the away leg... It may be a good idea to post it here, too. This is some ticket information for Danish fans with plans to travel to Amsterdam without tickets.

I have no idea how presale's going, but I don't think the game will sell out completely. I'm pretty sure about that, actually. Also: there is free presale, which means that a Club Card (= Dutch football fans ID system) is not required. You can walk up to any newspaper/tobacco store that has the Ticketbox logo and buy a ticket there, and you can also buy them at the fanshop inside the ArenA (left of the main entrance).

So, it looks quite good for you. And if the game sells out (which I don't believe it will) you can always contact Ticket Unlimited. They always have tickets:
http://www.ajax-usa.com/tickets/impossible.html

Dutch football fans feel no rivalry towards people from Scandinavian. There is actually quite a lot of sympathy (in generally, Dutchies sympathize with Brits, Irish and Scandinavians) and the atmosphere will not be hostile. Nevertheless, I would not recommend buying tickets for the more passionate sections of the ArenA. Do not buy tickets for sections 125 to 129 (the stand of the 'hard core', known as the F-Side) or sections 410 to 412 (the curve of the younger 'hard core', known as Vak 410). There are also groups of more fanatic fans in sections 415 and 428. In general, I would recommend to buy tickets for the 'long sides' (sideline stands) of the ground, rather than for sections behind the goals.

If you behave normally, keep a low profile and show a bit of respect (no provocations), you're unlikely to get into trouble.

K.

[Christian]

Thank you for the info. I think quite a lot of fans will travel without tickets.

Btw you are absolutely right about the hardcore fans in section 415 (and 416) as that is where the Brondby fans have tickets :eusa_dance:

[Kowalczyk]

Btw you are absolutely right about the hardcore fans in section 415 (and 416) as that is where the Brondby fans have tickets :eusa_dance:

Oh yeah, that's true: 415 is normally the section right next tothe away end, but for this game the away section is made bigger. I think the 415 guys will now stand in Vak 410 instead.

Vak 410 are the noisy bunch to the right hand side of the Brøndby support. Brøndby will have the North-East curve on the second tier, Vak 410 are in the North-West curve. The F-Side (which is where most of the thugs are) are on the other end: behind the South goal, bottom tier.

K.

[Philippe]

The F-Side (which is where most of the thugs are) are on the other end: behind the South goal, bottom tier.

thugs ? isn't it where you are ? ;)

[Kowalczyk]

thugs ? isn't it where you are ? ;)

Ummm... yes. :D

:headbang:

Seriously: most of the thugs are in 125 and the bottom bit of 127 and 128. I'm in the top half of 127. Mostly 'verbal violence' over there... (I plead guilty).

K.

[Philippe]

interesting, so would advice on that stand to go for a seat on the top half ?

[Kowalczyk]

Let me start by saying that the atmosphere on South H (that's the stand with entrances 125 to 129) is always very, very peaceful. 'Thugs' don't fight all the time, you know. Sometimes to fight rival hooligans, but that never happens inside the stadium, or during home games in the first place. There has never been a riot on the South H stand itself and I can only remember one major escalation outside of the section, 'below' the stands (home game against NAC, fall 2000).

So, as an Ajax supporter you'll always be safe. The thing is: the old 'hard core' of F-Siders are a very close community. They've all known each other for years and most of them seem to sit together in section 125. That is their territory and you and I would hardly fit in: it's very much a clan of 'old skool' Amsterdammers.

So, yes: if you every buy a ticket for South H you would feel more at home in the upper hald of 127 (if you want to stand during the game a yell stuff) or 129 (if you want to sit on your seat between 'normal people' and watch the game without singing).

Mind you: South H is one big section. Sections 125 to 129 are not real sections: they're just entrance numbers, really. If you have a ticket for section 129 you can go to your seat and sit down, but you're also welcome to walk to the middle (section 127) and join the people who are standing. The Ajax board have officially made section 127 and 128 'free standing' sections, where you can sit, stand or lie down wherever you want. Seat numbers don't count over there.

K.

[Kowalczyk]

It seemed to me that thze noisy part was in the center, and the right side of the stand when looking at the pitch looks rather quiet.

That's right. That's pretty much the structure of South H.

When standing on the South H stand, looking at the pitch, the far left is 129. People sit over there, mostly at the seat that is 'officially theirs'. The middle sections are 127 and 128, the "vocalists' sections": that's where people are standing and (if Ajax play well...) singing. On the far right is section 125, home of the old 'hard core', the first generation of F-Siders (parts of that generation anyway). They are not noisy, they usually sit down and chat, and seem quiet. But if things go off, these folks are the most violent. Section 126 is a sort of non-distinct. mixed 'buffer section'.

The difference between the 127/128 group and the 125 group is a matter of generation. The folks who 'founded' the F-Side back in 1976 did not stay in section F of De Meer until the end. After the 'bar incident' against Austria Vienna (1989) section F was turned into an iron cage (barbed wire, extra fences, high nets, etc.). Most of the 'original' F-Side then moved to section M of De Meer, which was where the real hooligans were in the 1990s.

The 'new generation' in sections F and G (which is pretty much the generation I belong to, although I don't feel part of any movement or group whatsoever; I am me and that's it) was younger, not nearly as violent but very loud.

Roughly, when Ajax moved to the ArenA the old section M gang went to 125, whereas the 'new generation' of section F went to 127. I repeat: this is roughly the story. Initially the club attempted to spread all of the fanatics over the ArenA, in order to rip the F-Side apart and 'neutralize' the problems. As a result of this, the atmosphere at the ArenA was completely and utterly dead in the first seasons. There was no 'core' of fanatics. The fans then asked Ajax if they could be placed back together again - and the club decided to co-operate. This wasn't easy, because the people in section 127 had to be kindly asked by the club to move to other sections, in order to 're-establish' the old fanatical group behind goal.

It took a few seasons, but that process has now more or less completed (as far as it's possible anyway). The atmosphere has improved, but the noise level of De Meer never returned - and probably never will. On the other hand: the atmosphere at De Meer is a bit romanticised by some. It was better, for sure, but let's not forget that this also has to do with the fact that the last ten years at De Meer were fantastic football-wise (1987-1996: three European Cups and some of the best football the world has ever seen), whereas the first nine years at the ArenA were (most of the time) mediocre or downright poor. If Ajax start to play world-class and entertaining football again, like they did in 1995, I'm sure the atmopshere at the ArenA wouldn't be that bad either (it was great during some Champions League games and 'Classics', so it is possible).

Finally... at the ArenA we've witnessed the 'birth' of what you could describe as a 'third generation' of Ajax fanatics: Vak 410. They strongly deny that they established Vak 410 because the F-Side (South H) was already full of season ticket holders. But I know a handful of young fanatics who wanted to get a season ticket for South H, were added to a long waiting list, and then decided to join Vak 410 instead.

So, in a way there are three generations of Ajax fanatics now:

1st generation
Section F from 1976 to 1989, section M from 1990 to 1996 and, after the move to the ArenA and a short period of being scattered, section 125 at the ArenA (although there are smaller groups all over the ArenA).

2nd generation
Section F from 1989 to 1996 and after the move to the ArenA and a short period of being scattered, sections 127 and 128 at the ArenA.

3rd generation
Vak 410 (some of the se guys were already there in the latter years at sections F and G of De Meer, but many of them are too young for that).

This is roughly (!) the picture. But first and foremost everyone's an individual, of course. I don't belong to any group other than the 'one man movement' that does everything my way, for the simple fact that it's me.

K.

[Philippe]

what about unnumbered cards ? where are you supposed to go when hold one of these ?